please forgive me if this has been covered, but i felt in the name of fairness i should at least throw this in.

anderson’s character in the movie, while absolutely perpetuating a handful of stereotypes, wasn’t 100% idiotic. he did actually help the process along rigging the computer to the radio system to help the military communicate by morse code [sort of a crude wording, i'm sure; forgive me]

BUT, thanks, ABW for being perceptive, not only to this movie, but to subtle forms of racism. it reassures me that when i do the same i’m not being hypersensitive or searching for things to complain about [as folks might think].

So at this point I’ll give a very cautious yes to participating in your discussion, though it frankly depends on what you say and how you say it. If it’s in your blog you’ll have to invite me to look at it, since I don’t follow your blog regularly.

i want a discussion, not an argument about why we shouldn’t have a discussion.

i’m on vacation now, so i’m not going to engage further on this thread. but in a few weeks i’m going to post on this, either here or on my own blog. i hope you’ll participate in the discussion then.

I think saying something racist or prejudiced is, more often than not, a conscious decision. You’re at the age where you should know what’s acceptable to say and what is not acceptable to say, you know? You control what comes out of your mouth, unless you have some sort of disability that prevents you from doing so. There’s a such thing as “proper etiquette”, and using racial slurs in casual conversation is not it.

Also, I *don’t* think “99%” of people will say something racist or prejudiced upon first meeting or talking to Nora. If he, she, or they does/do, that says a lot about him, her, or them, and quite frankly I would dismiss him, her, or them from then-on as well. So I can understand her logic behind doing that…

racism is the automatic, almost autonomic response of the ignorant–the undereducated. just because someone hasn’t had the opportunity to be enlightened from the outside, doesn’t mean they don’t have any insight at all.

dismissing everyone who says anything racist or prejudiced will cut out 99% of the people you encounter, and limit your debate partners only to people careful and risk-averse enough to avoid saying anything controversial.

don’t generally talk about “inter-PoC bullshit” because there’s no point. We could very easily get into a match of “my oppression trumps your oppression”, but what good would that do?

there you are again with the straw men. or is it a fatal failure of imagination? is the only discussion of inter-poc tension that you can imagine a duel of oppressions?

But as I explained to Claire, I think it’s infinitely more useful to talk about the causes of that kind of harassment — the stereotypes and misinformation and divisive tactics employed by those in power — than to recite the laundry list of wrongs on both sides.

it’s the straw men, then. where the FUCK did i suggest that we throw a laundry list of wrongs on both sides at each other? damn, nora, if you’re afraid to discuss this issue then just admit it. but stop putting words in my mouth.

So that’s why I dismiss racists. Besides that, it’s human nature — rightly or wrongly — to judge others by first impression, and if the first words out of someone’s mouth are racist? They shouldn’t be surprised if others dismiss them from there on. *Especially* if they roll up on an anti-racism site and say stupid shit. That’s like walking into a corporate job interview wearing clown shoes. You might be brilliant and competent, but if you don’t understand that workplace’s culture enough to fit in, nobody’s going to take you seriously.

Now. As for the rest of your last comment — you clearly haven’t been paying much attention to what I’ve said. I haven’t “thrown out” any of Claire’s arguments; I just don’t agree with some of her conclusions. But that’s between me and her. And at no point have I “forgiven” blacks for their bigotry. (Hell, I’m still disgusted by yours.) I acknowledged that black people harassing Asians is a bad thing. But as I explained to Claire, I think it’s infinitely more useful to talk about the causes of that kind of harassment — the stereotypes and misinformation and divisive tactics employed by those in power — than to recite the laundry list of wrongs on both sides.

And that’s as much as I’m willing to repeat myself.

I question everything a racist says because racist beliefs reveal a fundamental flaw in reasoning and/or information gathering. Racism requires a tremendous amount of self-delusion to support. You have to accept as truth things that can’t be supported by fact; you have to actively ignore or reject facts that don’t agree with your belief. There’s an emotional component to it that increases the chance of wrong decision-making — and it’s not that I don’t believe emotion shouldn’t be involved in decision-making, but when your emotions cause you to make the *wrong* decision then I think all your decisions should be suspect. If you decide that people of some other race are bad because you fear them, or if you refuse to recant a racist belief because your pride won’t allow you to, then that’s just plain wrong. And therefore everything else you believe may be equally tainted.

Crap — gotta go catch a train. Will finish later.